Was the wartime K98 ever made in calibers...

0 Kudos

Forum Jump

Author	Comment
eli griggs	Was the wartime K98 ever made in calibers...	Lead	[-]
Posts: 738 (11/03/09 09:52 AM) active member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Tags : None other than 8mm? I know about postwar modifications to 308 and 30-06 but during or prior to the war I wonder if the Germans made it in calibers for which they had abundant ammo and smaller units, like police, allies or occupying forces? Eli "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~ Thomas Jefferson ~ "In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity". - Albert Einstein WANTED - Lee Loaders - 7.5 Swiss, 7.62x39, 7.62x54r, .303 Brit WANTED- Turkey and Goose feathers for fletching arrows
Aubullet		#1	[-]
Posts: 1380 (11/03/09 10:17 AM) Veteran member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I believe they were still making custom Mausers on the 98 action well into the late 1930's in any number of special hunting and target calibers and loadings. There were also export models still being produced in other calibers until sometime near the start of hostilities anyway (1938-39?). Of course none of these rifles were actually K98's, and I'm not sure if any of these activities continued beyond the actual start of hostilities. Towards the end of the war a few experimental K98's were made with the shorter chamber needed to fire the 7.9 x 33 Kurz Patrone, which was a medium range assault rifle cartridge, but still in 8mm. You'll need to have a member with far more specific knowlege jump in to answer the real point of your question!
eagle7		#2	[-]
Posts: 4129 (11/03/09 11:03 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	The only export K98s I know of were sold to Nationist China in the 1930s. They bought Standard Modell Model 1933 rifles in the mid-1933s and later received K98s made at Mauser Oberndorf and Berlin-Borgsigwald in 1937 - 39. All of these rifles were in 7.9x57mm Mauser. When Imperial Japan joined the Axis the contract was cancelled. Like Aubullet said, there are supposed to be a very small number of very late war "last ditch" prototypes of the K98 in 7.9x33 Kurtz.
eli griggs		#3	[-]
Posts: 741 (11/04/09 03:32 PM) active member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Thanks for the info guys; I wonder if the 7.9 x 33 was potentially of any value as a military weapon, other than a reduction in materials such as propellant, brass, etc? Do you know if the 8mm short would have used detachable magazines or the standard, fixed five round scheme? Eli "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~ Thomas Jefferson ~ "In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity". - Albert Einstein WANTED - Lee Loaders - 7.5 Swiss, 7.62x39, 7.62x54r, .303 Brit WANTED- Turkey and Goose feathers for fletching arrows
Aubullet		#4	[-]
Posts: 1385 (11/04/09 06:09 PM) Veteran member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I think that the Kurz was intended to be similar to how we used the .30 carbine round instead of the 30-06. I don't know if the K98's magazine had to be modified in any way to use the Kurz cartridge, though due to it's shape, I'd suspect that it would feed okay from an unmodified magazine. Just guessing about that really.
Crunch130		#5	[-]
Posts: 941 (11/04/09 11:20 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Eli, Sure, the 7.9X33 had military value. How does a 125-gr bullet at about 2250 fps sound, fired on full auto out of a StG 44? Crunch
Kibbey	The Swedish K98k in 8x63 is One Answer	#6	[-]
Posts: 142 (11/06/09 09:58 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	During WWII the Swedes sold iron ore/steel to the Germans and wanted K98k's as part of the payment. Many were standard K98k's in 8x57. However, because the Swedes wanted to simplify their ammunition logistics, the heavy machine gun companies which used the 8x63 M1932 round were issued German manufactured K98k's chambered in the same caliber. I think these rifles were fitted with a muzzle brake to help deal with the heavy recoil of the 8x63 round. Supposedly these German export rifles were eventually sold after the war to Israel, but were then either rebarelled into 8x57 or 7.62 NATO. I have such a former 8x57 Swedish K98k in my collection. The giveaway is the Swedish inspector stamp. I've not seen a former 8x63 rifle, but I think it would have to have a notch cut into the receiver to load the 8x63 cartridge with a charger strip. Others may tell with more authority on that.
Aubullet		#7	[-]
Posts: 1392 (11/07/09 01:07 PM) Veteran member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	It would seem from what is written in Crown Jewels, that the M40 K98's did not leave Germany in the 8x63 chambering, but rather as standard 8x57's, and had there chambers recut by the Swede's, to the larger cartridge. It also appears that the back edge of the front receiver ring did not need to be notched to clear the larger round. While the case of that round is approx. 6mm ( about 1/4") longer than the standard round, it appears from pictures that the overall length of the loaded rounds are less different, so that it was able to be loaded without modifications to the magazine or receiver. Perhaps the rounds were loaded singly, thus saving the extra dimension taken up by the stripper clip?!?!
eli griggs		#8	[-]
Posts: 742 (11/09/09 09:09 PM) active member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Interesting stuff on the 8x63, how does it compare with the 8x57 and what's it like to shoot? Crunch, my mistake, of course the round has/had value as a military cartridge. I guess it's my stuck in the mud thinking of WWII as a battle-rifle, big cartridge war. I know that's not what happened but when I think of troops in combat, my minds-eye defaults to big rifles/cartridges like those used in the Grand, 8mm Mauser, Lee Enfield, Arisaka and the Mosin Nagants. Eli "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~ Thomas Jefferson ~ "In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity". - Albert Einstein WANTED - Lee Loaders - 7.5 Swiss, 7.62x39, 7.62x54r, .303 Brit WANTED- Turkey and Goose feathers for fletching arrows
Aubullet		#9	[-]
Posts: 1399 (11/10/09 12:58 AM) Veteran member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	How is shooting an 8x63 machine gun cartridge in a K98? It was supposed to have twice the muzzle energy of the standard 8x57 round, so I would guess that shooting it was like getting hit in the shoulder by an 800 pound gorilla, even with the muzzle break! It was used as an anti-tank round afterall!!!
eli griggs		#10	[-]
Posts: 744 (11/10/09 04:33 PM) active member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	How effective was the 8x63 mauser at taking out tanks and which tanks were most likely to fall to the 8x63? "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~ Thomas Jefferson ~ "In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity". - Albert Einstein WANTED - Lee Loaders - 7.5 Swiss, 7.62x39, 7.62x54r, .303 Brit WANTED- Turkey and Goose feathers for fletching arrows
Aubullet		#11	[-]
Posts: 1404 (11/10/09 07:38 PM) Veteran member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I have no info on the effectiveness of the weapon and ammo against any specific armour, or whether it was even effective against any armour at all. Perhaps it would have had a fair chance against troop armour like half-tracks and the like, or early and obsolete tanks that hadn't yet been up-armoured. I'd think it unlikely that it could take out any MBT's in it's day.

<< Previous Topic Next Topic >>

Add Reply

C&R Dealer Links	General Related Links
The Member's Map	The Gun Control Forum

Yuku free message boards

German Military Mausers Forum

Was the wartime K98 ever made in calibers...

Was the wartime K98 ever made in calibers...